Needs some opinions on PINGING

Discussion in 'Engine, Fuel and Exhaust' started by skeeter114, Mar 24, 2012.

  1. skeeter114

    skeeter114 Member

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    Here goes..... I have a 04 E Glide, 95in Bigbore, Weisco 10.5:1 pistons, Tman gear drive 590 Cams, Adjustable P- rods, Tman stage 3 ported heads, S&S roller rockers, Mikuni 45, Daytona Ignition, and running rinehart true duals.
    I"m getting a good bit of ping when pulling any load or a hill until I hit 3,000rpm then it goes away, the bike runs great. I have been trying to get that ping out and just went and had it dynoed thinking maybe it was a little lean?? Numbers were 110hp and 110tq. The mechanic said it wasn't lean and was running as good as it was gonna get. I would like to here some opinions on what I could do to get rid of the ping if anything??? Maybe run some race gas???? Or just try to ignore it when it happens?

    Oh Yeah---- timing is set at 2 and adv. curve at 2 which shouldn't be causing a problem there.
     
  2. Hoople

    Hoople Account Removed

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    What is the cranking compression in PSI. Do you know what the spark advance curves look like..
    Post a link to the instruction manual for your ignition.
     
  3. skeeter114

    skeeter114 Member

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    I'm not a gear head by any means but I watched the mechanic hook up the compression gauge and he let the engine turn about 4 or 5 times and seems like it was at 190psi. As far as what the curve looks like I dont know, I just know that it's on level 2 which is what Daytona Twin Tec recommends for high compression builds.

    Tank, I have tried STP Octane with no result. I have a bottle of Lucas Booster I'm gonna try. If it doesn't work either I'll try the Amsoil

    http://www.daytona-twintec.com/download/TC88A_Instructions.pdf
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 24, 2012
  4. Hoople

    Hoople Account Removed

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    190 PSI is within reason. What model Daytona Ignition are you using. You should have the paper work that came with it.
     
  5. skeeter114

    skeeter114 Member

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    TC88A, I put the link in on my earlier reply and negative on the paper work, lost it.
     
  6. fin_676

    fin_676 Experienced Member Staff Member Moderator Contributor

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    In this country we would call it pinking or detonation and is often attributed to using fuel that has insufficient octane rating it was a wee bit of a problem when lead free fuel was introduced and if i remember retarding the ignition timing by a few degrees would elevate the problem as the lower octane fuel burns quicker therefore needs to be nearer tdc when the plugs fire
    picked the following up from a wee bit of internet searching

    Detonation can be prevented by any or all of the following techniques:

    the use of a fuel with high octane rating, which increases the combustion temperature of the fuel and reduces the proclivity to detonate;
    enriching the fuel/air ratio, which adds extra fuel to the mixture and increases the cooling effect when the fuel vaporises in the cylinder;
    reducing peak cylinder pressure by increasing the engine revolutions (e.g., shifting to a lower gear, there is also evidence that knock occurs more easily at low rpm than high regardless of other factors);
    increasing mixture turbulence or swirl by increasing engine revolutions or by increasing "squish" turbulence from the combustion chamber design;
    decreasing the manifold pressure by reducing the throttle opening; or
    reducing the load on the engine.


    Personally i would try to boost the fuel octane first if it does not work try retarding the ignition timing anything up to 10 degrees but you may need to do a wee bit of calculating to get the best dwell angle
    as i have not set ignition timing using dwell angles for many years i am a wee bit rusty on this point i do remember having to do it on points based ignition systems if the cams had been replaced by high lift cams and the carb replaced by a larger one

    Brian
     
  7. Hoople

    Hoople Account Removed

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    Sorry, I missed the link you posted. What I would first try is setting both INITIAL Timing & Advance Slope Curve pots to "0" just to see if the ping is less or remains the same. Hopefully you will see a reduction. That will tell you that there is too much advance for the conditions & what to do next.

    If it does reduce the pinging, then there are a couple of things you can do. Would you know if you are using the stock factory map sensor? The TC88A advance curve is directly related to intake manifold pressure (Map sensor).
     
  8. skeeter114

    skeeter114 Member

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    Have no idea about the map sensor??? How would you tell?? Oh yeah it has S&S intake manifold if that matters.
     
  9. Hoople

    Hoople Account Removed

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    The Map sensor will probably have a part number on it that you can use to cross reference it. Delphi supplies them on today's models. Pretty sure back in 2004 the same was true but I am not sure. But first try the settings on the TC88A.. That unit has 30 minutes of data logging built into it (optional PC cables & software) plus you can write/program your own spark advance curves.

    But first you need to determine if it is too much advance.
    Here is a copy of the manual. Note relationship of spark advance vs intake manifold vacuum. Even on a pot setting of 0, it is a bunch if the vacuum is high.
     

    Attached Files:

  10. Jack Klarich

    Jack Klarich Expert Member

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    Better fuel is a big plus here with the higher compression you now have, backing off the advance and seat of the pants ride may help some, but in a word the GAS is junk now and the bit of ping you have will not hurt much it is just annoying