SE Download worked perfict!
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Ref. to RayA. Reply:
Yes the Power Commander alone abound $300.00, more like $369.95 for the PC-V. The $800.00 was a quote from an independent Harley Shop for installation and Dyno tuning. It turned out that that was an average fair quote when I checked around, including several distributers mentioned on this site.
If you’re going to go the extra mile for the PC you may as well get the full potential out of it on a dyno, other wise for sure you are paying too much for a canned map.
Ref. to 5284dva Reply:
I like my V&H Ovals. They have a nice deep sound at idle yet not obnoxiously loud. At cruising speed I can still hear my radio over the exhaust unless I’m getting on the throttle, at which point the sound from the exhaust becomes the music. In other words they sound great while accelerating.
To summarize my original intention for this Thread, if you have dropped thousands into modifying your engine no one would or should expect anything less than a custom map by way of a Race Tuner, PC or Thunder Max. It’s necessary!
On the other hand if you intend to keep your engine stock and/or limit your performance improvements to just a better sounding exhaust with a little less back pressure and less restricted air intake, you can compensate for the AFR changes with just the Factory Stage One Download without adding anything more than a software change. No extra boxes, no extra wiring, simple and clean.
To begin with, this was my observation with a 2009 FLHX with Oxygen Sensors and I don’t have first hand experience with how the download performs with models prior to 2009. However the Dealership told me they had very good success regardless of year. The type of exhaust was what determined how well it worked. Obviously straight pipes or mufflers with very little back pressure may push the ability of the download beyond its design intentions. The V&H Monster Ovals didn’t work as well as the smaller ovals. Screaming Eagle and slip-ons of similar design work very well at bringing everything back together regarding an optimal AFR that doesn’t reduce fuel mileage and make eyes water.
It’s my belief that too much hysteria has been made about the factory AFR (14:6.1) as the attributing cause to overheating. The bottom line is that an air cooled engine has to have air flowing over it to keep it cool. Prolonged idling and slow moving especially in hot weather is the more oblivious reason for overheating. I’ve had water cooled bikes begin overheating for the same reasons. I would bet that given the same conditions with ambient air temperature being the same, there is little difference in actual engine heat with a richer AFR of 13:6.1. The difference is still not going to prevent your engine from overheating in adverse conditions.
If overheating is your main worry, invest in an oil cooler (just saw one with a high volume electric fan), and maybe even increase your oil volume with a deeper oil pan and extend the engine life at the same time.
If spending $250.00 and your time and labor installing a TFI, V&H or other similar fuel adder works for you go for it, it’s still a bargain compared to a PC or Race Tuner on an otherwise stock engine. I don’t think spending roughly the same amount on the download as the TFI as seeing me coming, especially since I didn’t have to do any installation and it’s Harleys own R&D.
Yes the Power Commander alone abound $300.00, more like $369.95 for the PC-V. The $800.00 was a quote from an independent Harley Shop for installation and Dyno tuning. It turned out that that was an average fair quote when I checked around, including several distributers mentioned on this site.
If you’re going to go the extra mile for the PC you may as well get the full potential out of it on a dyno, other wise for sure you are paying too much for a canned map.
Ref. to 5284dva Reply:
I like my V&H Ovals. They have a nice deep sound at idle yet not obnoxiously loud. At cruising speed I can still hear my radio over the exhaust unless I’m getting on the throttle, at which point the sound from the exhaust becomes the music. In other words they sound great while accelerating.
To summarize my original intention for this Thread, if you have dropped thousands into modifying your engine no one would or should expect anything less than a custom map by way of a Race Tuner, PC or Thunder Max. It’s necessary!
On the other hand if you intend to keep your engine stock and/or limit your performance improvements to just a better sounding exhaust with a little less back pressure and less restricted air intake, you can compensate for the AFR changes with just the Factory Stage One Download without adding anything more than a software change. No extra boxes, no extra wiring, simple and clean.
To begin with, this was my observation with a 2009 FLHX with Oxygen Sensors and I don’t have first hand experience with how the download performs with models prior to 2009. However the Dealership told me they had very good success regardless of year. The type of exhaust was what determined how well it worked. Obviously straight pipes or mufflers with very little back pressure may push the ability of the download beyond its design intentions. The V&H Monster Ovals didn’t work as well as the smaller ovals. Screaming Eagle and slip-ons of similar design work very well at bringing everything back together regarding an optimal AFR that doesn’t reduce fuel mileage and make eyes water.
It’s my belief that too much hysteria has been made about the factory AFR (14:6.1) as the attributing cause to overheating. The bottom line is that an air cooled engine has to have air flowing over it to keep it cool. Prolonged idling and slow moving especially in hot weather is the more oblivious reason for overheating. I’ve had water cooled bikes begin overheating for the same reasons. I would bet that given the same conditions with ambient air temperature being the same, there is little difference in actual engine heat with a richer AFR of 13:6.1. The difference is still not going to prevent your engine from overheating in adverse conditions.
If overheating is your main worry, invest in an oil cooler (just saw one with a high volume electric fan), and maybe even increase your oil volume with a deeper oil pan and extend the engine life at the same time.
If spending $250.00 and your time and labor installing a TFI, V&H or other similar fuel adder works for you go for it, it’s still a bargain compared to a PC or Race Tuner on an otherwise stock engine. I don’t think spending roughly the same amount on the download as the TFI as seeing me coming, especially since I didn’t have to do any installation and it’s Harleys own R&D.
