Piston slap at 30,000 miles?

[HDSickness]

Bike has been making alot of noise so I take her to the dealer and they say rear cyl. piston slap. Bought bike 2 years ago with 5,000 miles now have 30,000 and I have used only Redline syn 20/50 changing at 3-4 k miles. How could this happen? Is there something else could have caused this? It's a TC 88 EFI stage 1 air samson s/o and PCIII.

 

[Redfish-Joe]

Had a 2000 RK with 35k on it when the same thing happened.

 

[Hoople]

Bike has been making a lot of noise

The dealer said it is piston slap. Until you actually take some measurements, it's only what he thinks the noise is. It could be so many other things.

If it is piston slap, usually the noise is worse when the engine is cold & first started. You didn't say what year the bike is. (avatar 1999?) Can't look anything up without knowing what year it is. "Making a lot of noise" is not much to work with. Does it have piston cooling jets? On these dry sump engine, a piston cooling jet that had low flow would certainly cause it. Does your engine use 5 micron filters?

 

[HDSickness]

The dealer said it is piston slap. Until you actually take some measurements, it's only what he thinks the noise is. It could be so many other things.

If it is piston slap, usually the noise is worse when the engine is cold & first started. You didn't say what year the bike is. (avatar 1999?) Can't look anything up without knowing what year it is. "Making a lot of noise" is not much to work with. Does it have piston cooling jets? On these dry sump engine, a piston cooling jet that had low flow would certainly cause it. Does your engine use 5 micron filters?

Noise is worse when hot do not hear it when cold although a couple times when I started riding cold there was a knock and I shut her off and on restart no knock. Bike is a 99 TC EFI sounds to me alot like loud ticking and has been getting worse. Yes I use 5 micron filters.

 

[BUBBIE]

Noise is worse when hot do not hear it when cold although a couple times when I started riding cold there was a knock and I shut her off and on restart no knock. Bike is a 99 TC EFI sounds to me alot like loud ticking and has been getting worse. Yes I use 5 micron filters.

99 TC... Like said,,,,Noise could be a lot of things...

Have you looked to check the Shoe tensioners on the cam chains?
IF bad, lots of noise will come there. Cam cover needs to be removed to see.

The 99 model also had the cam drive bearing that was a ball bearing like the second cam (front) bearing is... Many went bad, dropping the balls out of balannce nd the cam would go to one side....BANG.... HD said they would ONLY replace them when they went BAD...

ALL 99 TC models had the ball style on the drive cam,,, but do you KNOW IF yours was change out from ball to the roller?... The owner of the bike would have had to have it done,,,,UNLESS it BLEW and HD did the swap-out clean up and replacement, the HD dealer should be able to run your bike Vin number and see...

It Could be that.

They replace that ball bearing (on rear drive cam) with a Roller style bearing in the second 1/2 year of the 2000 models. Mine was on the first half year

A rod could be the knock... But would do it more than once and shut off and it is gone on start-up???????
Was the oil clean when changed,,, Did it have a lot of shinny slivers of metal on the magnetic drain plug? (bad crank/rod issues)

Redline 20/50,,,You are using the Best in Oil but things still CAN happen...

Do you have an oil pressure gauge or the red Idiot light?

Has the oil light gone OFF right after starting? flickering at all? If you have a gauge, what does it read? hot and cold?

Have you adjusted the primary chain???

enough for now....... get back with some answers and we'll try more.

signed....BUBBIE

see some of your post....

Is it really necessary?
Views: 1,277
Posted By 99rkc
Re: Is it really necessary?

I replaced my cam chain tensioners to hydraulic kit at 16,000 miles cams were worn so I had SE 203 s put in only because they had hard facing worn off even though I have used only M1 syn. since I got...
Forum: General Harley Davidson Topic

SO you have a lot to tell us about the things you have done.

 

[HDSickness]

99 TC... Like said,,,,Noise could be a lot of things...

Have you looked to check the Shoe tensioners on the cam chains?
IF bad, lots of noise will come there. Cam cover needs to be removed to see.

The 99 model also had the cam drive bearing that was a ball bearing like the second cam (front) bearing is... Many went bad, dropping the balls out of balannce nd the cam would go to one side....BANG.... HD said they would ONLY replace them when they went BAD...

ALL 99 TC models had the ball style on the drive cam,,, but do you KNOW IF yours was change out from ball to the roller?... The owner of the bike would have had to have it done,,,,UNLESS it BLEW and HD did the swap-out clean up and replacement, the HD dealer should be able to run your bike Vin number and see...

It Could be that.

They replace that ball bearing (on rear drive cam) with a Roller style bearing in the second 1/2 year of the 2000 models. Mine was on the first half year

A rod could be the knock... But would do it more than once and shut off and it is gone on start-up???????
Was the oil clean when changed,,, Did it have a lot of shinny slivers of metal on the magnetic drain plug? (bad crank/rod issues)

Redline 20/50,,,You are using the Best in Oil but things still CAN happen...

Do you have an oil pressure gauge or the red Idiot light?

Has the oil light gone OFF right after starting? flickering at all? If you have a gauge, what does it read? hot and cold?

Have you adjusted the primary chain???

enough for now....... get back with some answers and we'll try more.

signed....BUBBIE

see some of your post....

Is it really necessary?
Views: 1,277
Posted By 99rkc
Re: Is it really necessary?

I replaced my cam chain tensioners to hydraulic kit at 16,000 miles cams were worn so I had SE 203 s put in only because they had hard facing worn off even though I have used only M1 syn. since I got...
Forum: General Harley Davidson Topic

SO you have a lot to tell us about the things you have done.

Upgraded cam chain tensioner to new hydraulic along with 203 cams,cam bearings, oil is always clean no metal on plug, adjusted clutch and primary chain recently, no change. Idiot oil light only and light goes out as normal,

 

[Hoople]

I would try a mechanic's stethoscope. You might be able to tell if it is upper cylinder or cam chest noise. They are great tools if used properly. I would also cut open a used oil filter. If you have any accumulation (outside to inside flow), see if it is magnetic material or not. Ball/roller bearing, cam material will be magnetic. Also install an oil pressure gauge just to see what the psi is and you have what is expected. Adjustable pushrods?

 

[BUBBIE]

Hoople asked about Adjustable push rods?

You Saying the noise increases when warmed-hot...

The engine increases in size when hot. IF the adjustable P-rods are Not set up (pre-load) enough, the growing engine (normal heat caused) will allow the lifters to make noise...

I keep my bikes adjustables set-up at 3 full turns of pre-load. My SE slender tapers (24 per inch) pushrods call out for 2.5 turns.

Noise when Hot could be this. What is troubling though WAS it quiet before for some time and came on Gradual?

Dr. Hoople has the stethoscope mention, good to check.... :bigsmiley12:

get back here for more...

signed....BUBBIE

 

[HDSickness]

No adjustable pushrods...Could lifters do this? Bike runs great no smoking or oil consumption. I will cut open a filter but wouldn't I see flakes on drain plug?
Thanks for help guys.

 

[Hoople]

but wouldn't I see flakes on drain plug?

Not if it's non ferrous material such as aluminum. No one thing will give you a positive answer. Collect to try and sort it out.
Sound should really be worse when engine is stone cold.

I can't explain hearing a knock, stopping and restarting the engine and the sound goes away. That's not piston slap to me.