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Replaced regulator, but still not charging

Thanks All, for your thoughts and suggestions. I really don't mind testing, checking and double checking everything, cuz I want to be darn sure before spending significant time and money replacing the stator. I have a HD service manual for my specific bike and year. The charging system schematic shows the regulator's +12 output wire connected to the AUX post of the 30 Amp Main Circuit Breaker. The other side of the circuit breaker's BATT post connects to the starter and from the starter to the battery. This Main Circuit Breaker and the wiring have to be good and functioning properly, or the bike wouldn't start and continue to run until the battery discharges.

I have double checked the ground wire from the regulator. It is cleanly bolted to the frame. I've used an ohmmeter to measure countinuity from here to another part of the chassis. I've also measured +12V from battery POS directly to this regulator ground wire where it's bolted.

I work with and understand electronics, which is why I'm still puzzled that if the stator is putting out AC, and the regulator is new, and all the wiring seems to be good, why don't I get 14V across the battery, even if the stator isn't putting out adequate current? The only explanation I can come up with is that the stator appears to measure good when it's unloaded, but under load (connected to the regulator) it must not be good?
 
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It is very strange all three stator output tests are all within a volt of each other. If 1 phase was dead shorted, it would affect 2 of the 3 outputs. If 1 phase was wide open, you would still see Some charging action and you are not seeing any.

I can't see the wiring diagram to know if this is a waste of time, but if there is a CB between the + regulator output to the battery, temporarily jumper it out. I would make up a 12 gauge jumper wire with a heavy clips on both ends. Connect it between the + output of the regulator and directly to the battery positive. See what the results are.

This new regulator you purchased, was it a Genuine HD in a new box?

Since you say your handy around electrical things, if you happen to have an old 10-12 amp 12v "boat" battery charger laying around collecting dust you can use the transformer inside of it to test the stator in stand alone mode that would be much more reliable than just a voltage output test. Just a thought if you want to be sure before you tear into the primary..

Jake, Would there be a Remote chance that the female crimp connectors on the stator side wires are pushing back into the rubber weather connector and not making contact with the male crimp connectors on the regulator side. At least on my bike, I noticed today that the rubber water seal does not actually lock the pins into place thereby allowing them to push back into the rubber holder and not make contact with regulator male crimp connector. I thought I was seeing things. Each time I looked at the female crimp connectors they were going deeper and deeper into the rubber weather seal.

Just thought I would add that into the mix.

Also did a little more research today and found out the stator phase windings are not configured as "Star" which I thought they were, and are configured as "Delta". So for time being, hold off on xformer thing.

But you certainly can take (3) 150watt outdoor flood lamps and wire 1 across each set of stator pins. Start the bike and check for even glow on all three flood lamps. It will really give you a good indication of having 1 or 2 shorted phases. You can't have a shorted phase and at the same time have equal brightness in all three lamps. There would have to be an imbalance.
 
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The Deutsch connector (stator to VR connection) on my bike is different from Hoople's 09 Dyna. Thanks for the suggestion, but I checked it and all the pins are fine and snug. I will perform the 3 flood lamps loaded stator test next.

Also, I will jumper out the CB as a test, even though the schematic sure seems to rule it out.

BTW, the new VR I purchased and installed is a genuine HD, purchased from my dealer and came in a sealed HD box. Since my symptoms (no 14V across batt when running) are identical, I suspect my old VR is fine.
 
Jake good follow up. I also would not give up looking for the answer because when against unusual problems, "I just gotta know" even if it means spending a potfull of time finding it out. Realize the floods will only provide a few amps of load but my hunch is you will have to see some imbalanced in light output if just 1 or 2 phases had some shorted turns and the third phase was intact. I can't imagine all 3 phases are identically shorted exactly the same amount. The 38-40 amp 3 phase stator (#30017-08) is made up of (3) 34' coils of 17 gauge magnet wire having .1919 ohms per phase before wiring them in a Delta fashion. I can't see your stator being much different. Therefore just a few shorted turns should make a big difference. I am coming up with an inexpensive stator loader (under $25) which will apply a good 25 amps to the 3 phases but at the moment it is still just a model. It will also be handy to indirectly test the magnet strength of the rotor by measuring current load vs RPM. It's something I will build and have but probably never need.:p

It is really weird because I just can see you having totally Zero output charging volts going to the battery (which you do) and still have 30 volts across each stator phase and be within a volt or 2 of each other.

See what the next test results are.
 
One last note. I had similar problem. Have you noticed any increased vibration in recent time around when charging acted up? Mine started about a week before my bike wouldn't start. What happened was the magnets on the rotor had slid around together (thus the vibration from off balance) and of course it charged a bit but with 1/3 of magnets to together was not charging enough to keep battery up. One more thing to check . When you pull rotor flip it over and make sure all the magnets are evenly spaced. Do not drop it or bang on it as this can make them go bad too. Hope that helps.
 
CBB, thanks for the heads up re the rotor magnets...haven't noticed any increased vibration.

Well, the stator load test was very revealing. I used three 150W lightbulbs, started the bike and all three lamps began glowing. Throttled up and all three got brighter and looked balanced. Hooked up voltmeter across one lamp, throttled up and read a max of about 25 VAC. Moved voltmeter to next lamp and measured lower volts. All three lamps now are much dimmer. Move voltmeter to third lamp and measured even lower volts. All three lamps are now dark. Moved voltmeter back to first lamp and now only reading about 5 VAC no matter how high I rev up. Shut down bike.

Hmm...evidently as stator heats up and lamps heat up (higher resistance, providing increased load) less current is produced. I let the bike cool down and recharged battery. After about three hours (engine is still slightly warm to the touch, but lamps are obviously cool) I fire up again. All three lamps are still dark and only measure about 5VAC across one lamp when throttled up. Shut down for the night.

This morning before going off to work, fired up, all three lamps glow evenly, measured about 25 VAC across one lamp. Hold throttle steady and watch the voltmeter reading drop. Within moments, all three lamps are dark. When the voltmeter reads below 7 VAC, I shut down (it's 5:45AM inside my garage and I don't want to tick off my neighbors any more!).

At this point I have to conclude that the stator/rotor system is not producing adequate current, especially after heating up and under load.
 
Wow very interesting. Maybe when the magnet wire heats up, side to side wire turns short against each other.

You did say you always wanted to install a Screaming Eagle Compensator didn't you??:p:p
 
A bike builder/freelance Harley mechanic buddy helped me over the weekend. First thing that was noticed was that the crank nut was loose. Loctite loosened up? No loctite applied or not torqued at the factory? As a result, rotor was wobbling and most of its teeth around the spline had sheared off. Some teeth had "welded" onto the spline and had to be filed out. Rotor had also been rubbing against the stator. Replaced both and also the crank seal. So now I have a new VR, new stator, and new rotor. Charging system working fine. Looking forward to many miles of happy riding...heading for Sturgis this summer. Thanks all for your help and suggestions!
 
Jake Fatboy said:
No loctite applied or not torqued at the factory? As a result, rotor was wobbling and most of its teeth around the spline had sheared off.
Click to expand...

Wow it would have taken Superman with X-ray vision to see that was coming. Great troubleshooting on your part & thanks for getting back with what you found.
 
Jake Fatboy, very good bit of troubleshooting there, and yes if you were a DIYer you would have been in the primary and found the ugly truth anyway. Glad you got it sorted while it was in the shop and wishing many miles with smiles!:cheers
 
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