Nightrider IED ordered

Discussion in 'Engine, Fuel and Exhaust' started by Daytrip, Feb 22, 2008.

  1. Daytrip

    Daytrip Member

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    Well, after researching the SERF and finding there is none for 08, I decided to go with TFI and stage one a/c. Then I read about the Nightrider IED and talked to the service mangager of my Harley dealership about it. We decided to give the IED a try.

    I found Steve at Nightrider to be accessible and quick in replying to questions. For instance, it took less than an hour to get the following from him. I asked if I need to change the a/c if I used the IED. He answered:

    Alan;
    The O2 IED works equally well with or without the Stage 1 upgrades. The O2 sensor and the O2 IED will control the fuel mixture to 14.2:1 in the closed loop mode, no matter what changes you make to the engine.


    Stephen Mullen
    SPMullen LLC
    NIGHTRIDER.com - Motorcycle Performance Information
    Home

    My service manager buddy is hoping that we get the beast cooled down enough not to require any more mods. I'm not looking for racing power, just smooth performance and a little cooler engine. I'll leave the stock a/c and see what happens with just the IED. I've read some positive reports from those who've done this.

    I'll report my experience asap. I should receive the gizmo next week, and hopefully the weather will permit a couple good rides.

    BTW--I'm a pastor, not an employee or rep from Nightrider. :rider
     
  2. rsneede

    rsneede Member

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    Don't want to burst your bubble, but I installed a set of IEDs on my '08 FXDC, didn't really notice any difference (of course it's still winter here so overheating isn't an issue) In regards to the stage I air cleaner, my reading suggests that you would still need to adjust the air/fuel ratio with either an ECM flash or aftermarket enrichening device as the IED only works in closed loop mode, which only occurs at idle or small throttle settings such as steady cruising.
     
  3. Daytrip

    Daytrip Member

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    I'm going to wait until hotter weather to make the judgment call. The heat last summer was nearly unbearable when stopped at a red light. If $70 gets it done, I figure I've saved a few hundred bucks I was going to spend on stage 1 and tfi or other fuel management system. I'll let you know what I find out.
    As I said, some have already reported good (independent) experiences.
     
  4. Daytrip

    Daytrip Member

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    Here's one report:

    I removed the Screamin' Eagle A/C and installed the stock A/C. With the IED's still installed I rode the same route as the previous two tests.

    My seat-of-the-pants impression is that the bike runs OK with the stock A/C and the street legal SE slip-ons, but it is not as responsive as it was with the SE A/C. It accelerates OK, but not quite as strong as with the SE A/C. Part of my impression may be that I no longer can hear the intake sucking with the stock A/C like I did with the SE A/C.

    Anyway, so that people do not have to go back to my previous post, I am posting the temperature results for all three tests below. All the tests were performed on my 2007 Road King Classic without the windshield installed. I rode the same 13 mile loop each time. I tried my best to ride the same on each test, but there were some variations due to traffic conditions. The ambient temperatures were within 2 degrees F for all the runs (76-78) degrees.

    Test 1 is with the SE A/C, SE slip-ons and without the IED's
    Test 2 is with the SE A/C, SE slip-ons and with the IED's
    Test 3 is with the stock A/C and with the IED's

    A. Stopping after a 55mph ride with occasional brisk acceleration-
    Test 1 Front Cyl 310-315 degrees, Rear Cyl 330-337 degrees
    Test 2 285-290 310-322
    Test 3 257-265 285-293

    B. Stopping at a traffic light, riding one more block and checking temps-
    Test 1 Front Cyl 325-330 degrees, Rear Cyl 345-355
    Test 2 298-310 320-328
    Test 3 280-287 300-308

    C. Stopping at the security gate in my community, riding 1/2 mile home at 25-30mph
    Test 1 Front Cyl 350-355 degrees, Rear Cyl 380-385 degrees
    Test 2 330-340 355-365
    Test 3 305-315 330-338

    My conclusion is, that without any question whatsoever, installing the Nightrider IED's helped my engine run cooler. It also confirms that the addition of a freer flowing air cleaner makes a bike run hotter. It is understood that hotter running is mainly the result of a leaner mixture.

    For the time being, I am going to leave my stock air cleaner on. However, I am going to do some further investigation before I decide whether to put back the SE A/C.

    It is my understanding that the O2 sensors only impact the ECM at throttle settings below about 40% throttle (closed loop) which is where most of us ride when cruising around or riding at steady legal speeds on the highway. With throttle settings above 40% (open loop) the O2 sensors have no impact on the ECM, but the ECM richens the mixture according to how it is programmed. Basically most of us only run in open loop when accelerating hard or riding at high speeds.
     
  5. rsneede

    rsneede Member

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    Hmm. That is a substantial reduction in temp. It doesn't say if the ECM was flashed when the SE air cleaner was installed or not. If it was, that could account for the lower temps with the stock (more restrictive) air cleaner in place. I'm not saying the IED isn't a good upgrade or cost effective, just that the IED by itself won't compensate for a more free flowing intake. I just got back from a 100 mile ride mixed town and freeway, 60 degrees out, runs great as long as the revs are above about 2500, bit rough below that but no surging, popping or other unruly behavior. Engine heat felt fine at lights and etc. I just didn't notice any difference between the engine running with or without the IED. I intend to leave them on though, and wait for summer, as you say. I've considered putting on the Stage I intake and mufflers but it runs so nice the way it is I'm not sure I want to mess with success just to gain a few more horsies. Hope it works out for you, the nice thing about these IEDs is it is so easy to install or remove, takes 5 minutes.
     
  6. Daytrip

    Daytrip Member

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    It doesn't say if the ECM was flashed when the SE air cleaner was installed or not.

    He did not have the ECM flashed. Someone asked that question and he responded in the negative. He had used a fuel management device that he was disappointed with and so he took it off and tried the IED's.
     
  7. Mr. Clean

    Mr. Clean Member

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    I am the guy that posted the temperature tests on another forum.

    I purchased my bike used with stock exhaust and the SE air cleaner. The previous owner had V&H slip-ons and a PCIII that he removed before trading the bike in. The ECM is stock - no download. I had it dynoed shorly after I bought it and in closed loop the A/F was 15.1. I purchased and installed the Nightrider IED's, and the bike ran cooler. The A/F is probably around 14.6 or 14.7. I also installed the street legal SE slip-ons, but they did not seem to have any effect, except slightly louder.

    After running the first two tests, at the suggestion of someone else, I installed a stock air cleaner and got the results in Test 3. I am guessing that the closed loop A/F is around 14.1 or 14.2

    I am currently running the stock A/C, the SE slip-ons and the O2 IED's. I am planning to take off the IED's have the dealer install the Stage I download and then reinstall the IED's. I will run more temperature tests and possible put the SE A/C back on, or not.
     
  8. Daytrip

    Daytrip Member

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    Thx for the post. I've seen 8 or 10 who have tried the IED's with good results; but not everyone is entirely happy and want more performance gains than they can deliver. In my case, I just want a cooler engine--at a good price! I already have good sound--with the older model SE slipons.
     
  9. DYNAGUY

    DYNAGUY Active Member

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    I got a stage one download. Plus the IEDs installed. Bike run great. Found a race fueler for 75.00 on ebay, dealer dialed it in on dyno for 70.00. With all this bike flat moves out. After a hard run in 63 deg temp. Head temps are 242 front, 245 rear.:bigsmiley11:
     
  10. Daytrip

    Daytrip Member

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    The IED arrived on Thursday--at least 1 day ahead of the promised delivery date.

    No time to hook it up though. I'm working on our fence and taking my puppy to obedience school today. Maybe Monday I can "git 'er done."