Cams and Pumps

Discussion in 'General Harley Davidson Topic' started by Mad Dog Jim, Jan 23, 2011.

  1. Mad Dog Jim

    Mad Dog Jim Banned

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    I am staring to gather thoughts and opinions for next winter's bike project. My 08' FLSTC will have about 25k on it by then. I am thinking about Cams, Lifter, Rods, and Pump. Looking for sound advise.

    I know that the TC96's have low pressure at low idles, so I wonder if there is a pump that will boost that so a guy could safely drop his idle down. Not a biggy, but the old patato sound would be gnarly if it can be accomplished.

    I am not a cam guru by any stretch, but I know that I love the lope of a cammed bike. Where I could use more torque is in the low to mid range. I don't really run it wide open much...

    While I'm in there I'll swap out lifters and rods too, so looking for advise there.

    And, I'm kind of a kit guy so maybe someone packages everything I would need in one box? Though I'd peice it out if that was the smart thing to do.

    Any ideas? Especially from guys who do a lot of this...
     
  2. TQuentin1

    TQuentin1 Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Firstly, your '08 already has the roller chain configuration, hydraulic tensioners and the higher volume pump. When your engine oil heats up, at idle you will have what seems like low oil pressure, but it is not pressure but rather oil flow that is important. So I would NOT recommend reducing the engine idle on a TC. You could add a different pressure relief plunger spring that would increase the pressure at idle, but it would do that across the entire rpm range.

    Remember that when your engine idle oil pressure drops below the approx. 12 psi level, the check valves in the under-piston sprayer jets close to help reduce the load the engine has as the pistons head down in the jugs. If you raise the oil pressure above the point where the check valves close, then this design feature is defeated.

    Unless something is wrong with what you have in the cam chest, or you are wanting a cam change for more lower end torque or something like that as you said above, I am not sure why you want in there. If you are inspecting the tensioner shoes, that can be done without removing the support plate. If you insist on disturbing the support plate, then include replacing the cheap INA roller bearings with the Torringtons. That is a worthwhile up-grade, but not justified just for that.

    However, "your ride, you decide!"

    For low end cams: check out the 21 or 26 grind from Andrews Products
    Lifters: stick with the HD "B" lifters
    PRs: get any of the chrome steel "EZ" type adjustables
    Pump: unless you think there is something wrong with yours, reuse it with new orings
    Fueler: Check out the 3 Gen series from Dobeck (TFI)

    TQ
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2011
  3. Mad Dog Jim

    Mad Dog Jim Banned

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    Thanks man!

    I guess the three main outcomes I'm looking for are low end torque, cam lope sound, and lower idle. But proper performance overall outweighs all of that. I'm always more interested in total system than making one thing cool. (If that makes sense)

    All opions and experience welcome though
     
  4. Jack Klarich

    Jack Klarich Expert Member

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    IMO keep your idle up for oil pressure FLOW and the electronics READ charging system, you can get the lope with the right cams and the idle will not have to suffer
     
  5. BUBBIE

    BUBBIE Well-Known Member

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    I have an 09 FLHR(posted this all over here and many forums)

    I went with V&H slip-ons Nice easy sound.. SE air unit and TFI..
    THEN later for sa littlem MORE POOF, I went with SE255 cams.. I am really pleased with the added LOPE the cams give (550 lift) but NO KLANK as some fast ramped cams give.

    The SE 255's are Great Bolt-In cams especially on the stock stage-one 96" bikes.Really make them perform. Others say there are Many other Cam choices BUT the SE 255's doesn't affect the warrenty as HD puts them in a few of their 103 bikes.

    The Torque come on early and I like that on the Road King.

    As far as a different Pump... I had a Feuling oil pump that HD copied for their newer design oil pump in the 07 and up TCs...

    The added width and size of the Gerotors in Feuling oil pump OR the New HD pump(you have) Do Not afford any Lower engine speeds at Idle to work properly, Like TQ1 mentioned....

    The Lope I hear from the SE 255 cams, is a Nice welecomed Bonus.

    Now I'm forgetting the cam Make and number/design that R. Bingham says "Has a NASTY LOPE" but there is a thought for you..

    Liking mine for Now, the way it is. BUT,,,, TIME does have a way to Change things and BIGGER is probably gonnnaaa happen.(103 next)

    signed....BUBBIE
     
  6. Breeze3at

    Breeze3at Well-Known Member

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    And if you do set the idle down, the multitude of sensors tell the ECM there is a problem, and the ECM raises the idle back to factory spec.
    I miss the potato's on my T.C., but seldom enough to dust off and fire up the Shovel.:)
     
  7. Jack Klarich

    Jack Klarich Expert Member

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  8. TQuentin1

    TQuentin1 Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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  9. R.Bingham

    R.Bingham Active Member

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    That would be the SE 204. That is a fine cam for the 96 as well if you want to do a 103 big bore later.
    As far as fuel management I would recommend the Revolution Performance Precision EMS tuner for all big twins 04 and up. With this tuner you get the optimum performance at all times. It does not require a dyno tune and will easily accommodate any upgrades later, again without any dyno tune.

    Revolution Performance Precisionâ„¢ EMS

    HTH,
    Randall
     
  10. Mad Dog Jim

    Mad Dog Jim Banned

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    More on the SE255 please

    By bolt in, that means I don't need anything else? Just buy the cams and a gasket kit and go for it?

    I imagine it would be wise to upgrade the tensioners too?

    Anything else?