2000 Road King with Sidecar Stops Running/Won't Start

[gs34]

My experience with sensors says that if they do not check within +/- .1-.2 of what the spec is....they are bad.
Thiis is one of the reasons a digital MM is necessary
I would also test the BAS to make sure it is operating should be closed in the normal position then open to break the voltage flow.

 

[Hoople]

Should I just throw caution to the wind and put in a new crank sensor, as it has lower than normal output?

2.8V AC on the crank sensor is a ton of signal. I would call that OK for now. You need to make sure you have B+ on the injectors during cranking. Knowing fuel pump pressure would also be nice. Need schematic.

 

[SirDimsdale]

Thanks. I saw that posting, too, before I started this thread. Here's where I am at now:

1) The crank sensor is putting out about 2.8VAC while cranking which I have been told is a bit low, so it could very well be the culprit and have caused both the DTC 41 and 56 codes

2) Still doesn't account for the 44 code for the Bank Angle Sensor

3) I discovered a method to clear the codes from the ECM

4) Still doesn't start and shows no "current" codes via speedo diagnostic


Any advice?

Should I just throw caution to the wind and put in a new crank sensor, as it has lower than normal output?

Should I test the cam sensor, too?

Seems odd that I have spark, but no fuel. Do all 3 sensors crank, cam and BAS shot down spark and fuel, or one or the other?

Thanks again to all who have helped. I am about to admit defeat and haul it to a dealer!

LL

I can't point you to data but I read today about broken or hanging BAS which shuts off the fuel pump to keep from causing a worse fire after 55 deg. angle fall. The broken support gives the ECM that signal.

 

[Hoople]

broken or hanging BAS which shuts off the fuel pump

If it is similar to post 2006 bikes, the system relay is released during BAS trigger. It kills injectors, fuel pump & ignition all in one shot.
OP says he has spark & fuel prime so should not be BAS. (?)
Just guessing without wiring diagrams.

 

[Lightnin Lyle]

Hoople,
Thanks again. I can send you pdf's from the 2000 Harley service manual. Which wiring diagrams do you need to see? Is there an email I can attach them to that works best for you?
Lightnin'

 

[Hoople]

I came across some diagrams for a 2000 FLHRI. I don't know how accurate these are. On your coil there are 3 wires and they are called position A,B & C. Position A looks to be Yellow/Blue. Position B looks to be Yellow/Green and position C is Blue/orange.
The Cam sensor is 3 wires. Red/white,, Black/white & Green/white.
You have relays called: An ECM power Relay, A fuel pump relay, A Starter relay, A Stop Light Relay. Is any of this close to what your manual shows.

Do you still have access to the fuel injectors under the tank? If so what are the color of the injector wires. Do you have easy access to the large 36 pin ECM connector?

 

[Lightnin Lyle]

Hoople,
Thanks for your dedication to my problem!

Here's what I know from visual inspection and/or my manual's schematics/diagrams:

1) Yes, ignition coil has A,B, and C wires: A=Y/BE; B=W/BK and C= BE/O
2) Yes, cam position sensor has 3 wires: R/W, GN/W and BK/W
3)Relays: Fuel Pump; ECM Power; Start Relay; Stop Lamp Relay
4) Fuel Injector wires: front=Y/GN and W/Y; Rear=Y/GN and GN/GY
5) I accessed neither the injectors nor the ECM connector, but I can break down the speedo/tank assembly and the ECM panel to get to them
6) BAS=GY, BK and LTGN/GY; Crank position sensor=R and BK

So, I think we have a match!
Lead on, MacDuff,
Lyle

 

[Hoople]

Everything matches except B terminal of the coil. Your diagram shows it being a Black/white wire and mine shows it being Yellow/Green.
Now my CARBURETOR 2000 wiring diagram shows a White/Black for Terminal B of the coil. By chance are you looking at the carb version of the coil schematic?

Another way to look at it => Another way to double check it=>
Each injector has a Yellow/Green wire. That much we both agree on. Follow those 2 wires from the injectors and they "should" tie together along with terminal B of the coil. Now that group of wires goes to terminal #30 of the fuel pump relay. At least that is what my manual shows.

Since you do show a Yellow/Green wire (power for injectors) going to each injector, I don't understand how terminal B of your coil can be White/Black. It really should be Yellow/Green.
(But it would be White/Black if you bike had a carb)

 

[Lightnin Lyle]

Hey Hoople,
OOOOppps! It was late and I typed the wrong colors. The B (+12VDC) connection is indeed Y/GN. Sorry for the confusion.

Any next steps for solving the no start, no fuel conundrum?

Thanks,
Lyle

 

[Hoople]

The B (+12VDC) connection is indeed Y/GN.

Ok.
We don't have the luxury of a break-out box or a fuel pump pressure tester so we have to work a little backward & make a couple of indirect tests the old fashion way.

Step #1. Place a voltmeter on terminal B of the ignition coil & frame ground. When you 1st turn on the ignition (with kill switch in RUN), you should read 12.5 volts for a few seconds and then it reads zero. Then while cranking the engine, do you read appox 11.0 volts at that coil terminal B. If YES, go to step #2
(this test told us if both injectors are getting battery voltage, the fuel pump relay is closing and if the crank sensor signal is being seen by the ECM. It also gives us a very strong, but not conclusive indication, that the cam sensor signal is also being seen by the ECM)

Step #2. Remove both cables going to the battery. Unplug the 36 pin ECM connector. If you look close at the ECM connector you will see identifiers for pin 1, 18,19 & 36. Once you establish row & pin #s, using your ohm meter in the 200 ohm range, measure the resistance from terminal B of the coil, to pin #24 of the ECM wiring harness connector. Record the value you read.
Now do the same only except with Pin#18 of the ECM connector (pin18 to coil B). What values do you read.
(this test told us if both injectors have good/shorted or open coils, and if the injector wiring going to the injectors along with the injectors connectors is in-fact OK)