2000 Road King with Sidecar Stops Running/Won't Start

Discussion in 'Electrical' started by Lightnin Lyle, Oct 28, 2011.

  1. Lightnin Lyle

    Lightnin Lyle Member

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    Looking for some advice. Here's what I know so far. Installed 99 TLEu sidecar on a 2000 Road King last week. Took it for a test ride around the block, tweaked the alignment, everything worked fine. Next day, took it on back roads to work and after 4 miles the engine just quit running, no sputter, no mechanical noise, just stopped dead in its tracks. Bike turned over but would not fire. Towed home.

    I have been going through the bike and sidecar and talking to a few local dealers and here's what I know:

    1) bike has spark, the fuel pump primes, but no fuel delivery to EFI
    2) bike will start on first crank and run on starting fluid through the throttle body (MM EFI)
    3) all fuses check out
    4) speedo diagnostics show 3 DTC codes: 41 crankshaft sensor; 44 Bank Angle Sensor, and 56 crank/cam sensor signal error; the codes are current not historic; disconnecting battery doesn't clear the codes
    5) pulled crank and cam sensors, no metal deposits on magnets
    6) discovered a break in the black wire in the sidecar harness, when brakes were applied the brake lights worked on the bike, but not on the sidecar (all lights turned off), repaired wire and all running, tail and brake lights function normally, now (there is no bulb in the right turn signal on the bike per TSM spec)
    7) I could just start replacing sensors, but it seems a little too coincidental that all three would fail simultaneously in the first run after the sidecar was installed
    8) throwing sensors at the problem seems premature without knowing what actually caused the failure and tripped the DTCs and shut down down the fuel
    9) this is a TSM config, not a TSSM, no security or rollover switch and the BAS is independent of the TSM and the ECM
    10) local dealers are in disagreement about "resetting" the TSM/ECM to be configured for sidecar operation
    11) when the run switch is cycled on and off, there is a "mechanical gurgling sound" in the region of the EFI throttle body, but no fuel is present after cranking
    12) bike doesn't start with sidecar unattached, either

    Is there something really obvious that I am missing here?

    The Road King only has 6K miles on it and ran perfectly the last ten years.
    Oil changed at 1200 mile intervals; HD synthetic everywhere

    Should I start putting the multimeter on every electronic component in the chain, beginning with the crank, cam and BAS sensors?

    Any help and suggestions in troubleshooting this issue before admitting defeat and towing it to a dealer is greatly appreciated.

    Thanks.

    Lightnin' Lyle
     
  2. Hoople

    Hoople Account Removed

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    The fuel injectors are sequential fire and must have a cam sensor signal to phase correctly. I don't have a schematic for a 2000 Road Kit but the cam sensor should be a 3 wire hall effect switch which is easy to check with a meter. Based on a 2001 schematic, you should have 3 wires. A red/white,,Black/white,, Green/white. Using a meter check the logic state of the Green/white wire while cranking the engine by hand (rear tire in gear, w/ grounded spark plugs). Logic state should toggle from zero to +5 volts.

    That signal is a must to have.
     
  3. ajayrk

    ajayrk Member

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    Check the ECM fuse under the right side cover. It is a five amp fuse next to the 15 amp fuel pump fuse. Also check the fuses under the left side cover. Look at the ignition fuse. You have a pinched wire some where.
     
  4. Lightnin Lyle

    Lightnin Lyle Member

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    Thanks for the help. Hand cranking with a sidecar could be problematic for me. Is there a simple way to test the cam sensor output to the ECM while cranking with the battery?
    Thanks again.
    LL
    P.S. Electrics are my achilles heel!
     
  5. Lightnin Lyle

    Lightnin Lyle Member

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    Thanks for your help. The fuses were the first thing I visually inspected when I had the bike towed home. I replaced both the ECM and the fuel pump fuse just to be safe, but still no fuel.

    I have visually checked most of the wiring, that's how I found the bad wire in the sidecar harness, but even after that was fixed no change.

    Thanks again,
    LL
     
  6. Hoople

    Hoople Account Removed

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    You could remove both spark plugs and just push the bike while in 5th gear. You just need to slowly turn the cams a few times. You want to see if your getting the sharp transitional logic state change from 0-5-0-5-0... volts on your meter.
    If you use the starter motor, the meter will not follow the logic level. The meter is too slow.

    Your absolutely sure that you do hear the fuel pump prime. Are you working with factory schematics?
     
  7. Lightnin Lyle

    Lightnin Lyle Member

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    Hoople,
    I am 99.99% sure it is the fuel pump priming when the ignition is cycled on based on location, sound and nearly 11 years with this bike. The new and unusual noise is on the EFI throttle body side when cycling run switch from on to off.

    So, could you walk me through this cam checking process. As in, set your multimeter to___; connect the the red lead to ____; black lead to _____; remove spark plugs; push bike and sidecar and watch led read 0 5 0 5 0, etc.

    Thanks so much for all of your help. This electrical stuff makes me crazy!

    LL
     
  8. Hoople

    Hoople Account Removed

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    I don't have a schematic for your bike so I can't give you a step by step. If I guess wrong, it could do damage and make matters worse. I thought you just needed some direction on which direction to take..
     
  9. Amish Hawg

    Amish Hawg Active Member Contributor

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  10. Lightnin Lyle

    Lightnin Lyle Member

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    Thanks. I saw that posting, too, before I started this thread. Here's where I am at now:

    1) The crank sensor is putting out about 2.8VAC while cranking which I have been told is a bit low, so it could very well be the culprit and have caused both the DTC 41 and 56 codes

    2) Still doesn't account for the 44 code for the Bank Angle Sensor

    3) I discovered a method to clear the codes from the ECM

    4) Still doesn't start and shows no "current" codes via speedo diagnostic


    Any advice?

    Should I just throw caution to the wind and put in a new crank sensor, as it has lower than normal output?

    Should I test the cam sensor, too?

    Seems odd that I have spark, but no fuel. Do all 3 sensors crank, cam and BAS shot down spark and fuel, or one or the other?

    Thanks again to all who have helped. I am about to admit defeat and haul it to a dealer!

    LL