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Starter Stall On Startup

Electrical and Lighting Systems

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Starter Stall On Startup
Published by glider (Community Liaison)
Published date: 08-31-2007
Battery cables on older bikes do break down and should be replaced if signs of starting problems like starter stall appear. If you were to look at the copper inside the plastic jacket by peeling it back after removal, you would see pretty shades of green in there, that's corrosion. In salty areas near the beach/ocean it is more of a problem because of the corrosive salt content in the air.

Usually a bad/corroded cable will show some signs of heat in it when cranking an engine if you do it a few times.

What I like to do is to solder on the end terminals and then seal the joint where the cable and terminal connect with heat shrink. It eliminates the entry point for the corrosion to begin.

Here's an excellent source for outstanding battery cables.
Cold Riders Yooper Page.

If you use a meter to test the cables, attach one end to the battery terminal proper on the +12 cable and the other meter lead to the other end of the battery cable. No need to disconnect the cables. Hit the start button, If the meter registers anything significant, the cable is exhibiting too much resistance and should be replaced.


A better description of this condition (starter stall) would be like hitting the start button and it cranks over a revolution or two and "pauses" then continues to crank. I have found that most times new battery cables or cleaning the terminals on BOTH ends of BOTH cables with a wire brush and reinstalling them minimizes/eliminates this condition.

With a warm engine, the compression is higher than a cold one because the engine parts (ie. rings) are expanded and sealing better so the compression is higher then.This usually needs more amperage to crank over than a cold engine does and thus the problem exhibits itself in starter stall.

If you suspect carbon buildup in the cylinders as a possible cause, there's a simple way of cleaning them. There is a product called sea foam http://www.seafoamsales.com/ that will do this as you drive the bike or what I like to do is to take a spray bottle filled with water and with the engine running at a fast idle, spray a steady stream of water into the intake and watch the carbon blow out the pipes. Use a few ounces of water doing this. Keep the engine speed up while you do this so it doesn't stall. Usually if you park the rear of the bike about a foot from a wall, you'll see black areas on the wall that are the carbon that was in the cylinders. The carbon raises compression and the starter combined with bad cables can't compensate for this and "kicks back" or stalls on a start attempt then.

Also another product called Marvel Mystery oil (my favorite) which is in a red and black can sold in most auto parts stores can be added to the gas at about an ounce or so to a tank full every few tanks and it will help to keep the combustion chambers clean. This product is a miracle worker. I have used it in engine oil in cars to free up sticky lifters and it works extremely well too. It's also great for cleaning out engine crankcases before changing oil if you add some to the oil and run the car for a few days normal driving before doing the oil change.
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Ride: 07 Road King Classic
 
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Old 11-25-2008, 11:49 PM     #2 (permalink)
New Family
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Re: Starter Stall On Startup

You set the spray bottle on stream or mist? Hard to believe it won't stall the engine, but I do believe you, Glider.

I'm getting starter stall. I'll replace cables as well. They're original stuff and I've been by the ocean for four years.
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Old 11-26-2008, 08:37 AM     #3 (permalink)
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Re: Starter Stall On Startup

Set it on stream and it's done with the RPM raised up to around 1500-1800.
You keep the water going and only slow the water down if the engine sounds like it's going to stall out.

The starter stall could be a weak (old) battery also.
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Old 11-26-2008, 10:07 AM     #4 (permalink)
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Re: Starter Stall On Startup

As always, a good collection of great ideas!! I've used the water trick on cars many times and it works wonders. If you've ever changed a head gasket on a car that was burning anti-freeze you'd see that one piston (where the coolant was going) was crystal clean and all the others were carboned up.

Question. I've mixed Marvel Mystery Oil in with the oil, but not with gasoline. It doesn't gum up the injectors at all?
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Old 11-26-2008, 11:22 AM     #5 (permalink)
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Re: Starter Stall On Startup

Sea Foam is the way to go.. I put some in my fuel tanks of all my vehicles.

Sea Foam Deep Creep is an other good way to remove the carbon from your cylinders..

The procedure is easy. Remove the air cleaner, warm the bike up to full operating temp, spray the Deep Creep into the intake, keep the RPMs up initially until you can get 10 seconds worth of spray down the throat of the motor.

Stop spraying, let the motor return to idle, then spray the until the motor dies. Let the bike sit for 10 minutes. Start it up and watch the smoke come out of your pipes. The smoke is the carbon and other crap loosened up by the Deep Creep. Run the motor until the smoke disipates.

I do this twice a year to all my bikes... It has help keep my 77 FXE's top end clean! I feel it's helped extend the time between top end rebuilds.
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Old 11-26-2008, 11:38 AM     #6 (permalink)
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Re: Starter Stall On Startup

Quote:
Originally Posted by krikket View Post
As always, a good collection of great ideas!! I've used the water trick on cars many times and it works wonders. If you've ever changed a head gasket on a car that was burning anti-freeze you'd see that one piston (where the coolant was going) was crystal clean and all the others were carboned up.

Question. I've mixed Marvel Mystery Oil in with the oil, but not with gasoline. It doesn't gum up the injectors at all?
It can be mixed with fuel or oil to be used as a cleaner.No problems with injectors.
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Old 11-26-2008, 12:29 PM     #7 (permalink)
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Re: Starter Stall On Startup

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Originally Posted by glider View Post
Set it on stream and it's done with the RPM raised up to around 1500-1800.
You keep the water going and only slow the water down if the engine sounds like it's going to stall out.

The starter stall could be a weak (old) battery also.
Battery is new. I've had this issue for some time.
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Old 11-26-2008, 03:25 PM     #8 (permalink)
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Re: Starter Stall On Startup

I would suggest doing this with the water and get a good pair of cables too.

These cables are about as good as it gets when you have a problem cranking. They are heavy duty welding cable that he makes them out of. More strands than the standard ones to carry current better.

Cold Riders Yooper Page.
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Old 11-26-2008, 04:38 PM     #9 (permalink)
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Re: Starter Stall On Startup

Thanks for the tip about cleaning out the carbon. Would you recommend using the Seafoam or the Marvel Mystery oil just prior to an oil change or does it matter?
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Old 11-26-2008, 04:51 PM     #10 (permalink)
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Re: Starter Stall On Startup

Whichever you use, I like to do it a few hundred miles before an oil change. I have had good results with the marvel.
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