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Bad stator

Electrical

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Old Jun 16th, 2010, 08:48 PM     #1
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Bad stator

Quote: Originally Posted by glider View Post
If you have had a stator that went bad, tell us what bike, what primary lube you used and how often you changed it. Also the year of the bike would help too.

Thanks

Hi Glide.
I'm trying to figure out if my stator went bad, and let's say that I'm not exactly Thomas Edison when it comes to electrical things, so I've been hitting the various forums looking for a problem similar to mine.

I have an '06 FLSTSC/I. For the last three weeks or so, both the check engine and low battery lights have lit up while I was riding, but would then go off after a few minutes. No problem starting the bike afterward but I used your primer on checking error codes and got a B 1004, followed by P/N 67033-04A, which is a part number for a speedometer. But my speedometer is fine.

Anyway, the last couple of days, the engine and battery lights have come on and stayed on. And after shutting off the bike, I haven't been able to start her back up. The battery just doesn't have enough juice to turn her over and the bike finally starts clicking, lights flicker. etc ....

I took the battery off the bike and had a neighbor test it with a digital meter (I don't have one). It had a reading of 18. He load tested it and said it seemed fine, although I don't know what the particular reading was. He put the battery on a charger for a couple of hours. I put it back on the bike and it started right up. But again, after riding it for about an hour, the to lights came on and I couldn't get the bike started after I shut it off: the battery was drained.

I opened up the primary window to smell the fluid (I use the HD Syn 3), because I read on the forum somewhere that a burned stator gives off a noticible smell. Nothing smelled strange to me.

I saw your primer on checking the charging system, but haven't tried it (no multimeter of my own right now). Any idea if it's the stator? If it was a car, I'd pretty much assume there was a problem with the alternator or belt, but with the bike, I'm not sure. Any idea what this could all mean? I'm especially puzzled by the B 1004 error code, since there is nothing wrong with the speedometer.
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Old Jun 16th, 2010, 09:10 PM     #2
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Re: Stator Gone Bad

Quote: Originally Posted by Casey0211 View Post
Hi Glide.
I'm trying to figure out if my stator went bad, and let's say that I'm not exactly Thomas Edison when it comes to electrical things, so I've been hitting the various forums looking for a problem similar to mine.

I have an '06 FLSTSC/I. For the last three weeks or so, both the check engine and low battery lights have lit up while I was riding, but would then go off after a few minutes. No problem starting the bike afterward but I used your primer on checking error codes and got a B 1004, followed by P/N 67033-04A, which is a part number for a speedometer. But my speedometer is fine.

I took the battery off the bike and had a neighbor test it with a digital meter (I don't have one). It had a reading of 18. He load tested it and said it seemed fine, although I don't know what the particular reading was..

I saw your primer on checking the charging system, but haven't tried it (no multimeter of my own right now). Any idea if it's the stator? .
This fix can get involved and if your not comfortable with fixing electrical things it may be best to have it looked at by a local indy. Since you got a reading of "18" on your friends meter, it kinda tells me your friends meter is not reading right or has a problem. The B1004 is an error for the Fuel Level Sending Unit and I don't see how that relates at all to your problem.
To repair this yourself will require you to buy a good meter.
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Old Jun 16th, 2010, 10:51 PM     #3
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Re: Stator Gone Bad

Quote: Originally Posted by Hoople View Post
This fix can get involved and if your not comfortable with fixing electrical things it may be best to have it looked at by a local indy. Since you got a reading of "18" on your friends meter, it kinda tells me your friends meter is not reading right or has a problem. The B1004 is an error for the Fuel Level Sending Unit and I don't see how that relates at all to your problem.
To repair this yourself will require you to buy a good meter.
And taking it to a shop may just be the best idea out there. But I also figure I'll never learn if don't give it a shot. I may just swing by Harbor Freight or Sears and pick up a meter of my own tomorrow and follow Glide's instructions.

The fuel level sending unit error might have an explanation. I have one of those tank lift kits that results in the fuel level light always being on. The thing that's strange is that I've had the tank lift on the bike for a couple years now. The low fuel levels stays on permanently, but the check engine light never came on before. And that doesn't explain the low battery light. If it is a stator, I feel pretty confident in my ability to put in a new one if the stator's bad. It's my ability to isolate and diagnose the electrical problem that I'm concerned about. Obviously, I don't want to replace the stator unnecessarily
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Old Jun 19th, 2010, 10:49 AM     #4
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Re: Stator Gone Bad

Quote: Originally Posted by Hoople View Post
This fix can get involved and if your not comfortable with fixing electrical things it may be best to have it looked at by a local indy. Since you got a reading of "18" on your friends meter, it kinda tells me your friends meter is not reading right or has a problem. The B1004 is an error for the Fuel Level Sending Unit and I don't see how that relates at all to your problem.
To repair this yourself will require you to buy a good meter.


I bought a new battery, since the existing one was already 2-3 years old, and also a cheap multi-meter from Harbor Freight (probably not the good meter you were referring to, but serviceable, I hope), and did at least some of the testing that Glide posted. The results are below and seemed pretty good. Until I got on the bike and again and took a couple short rides. After putting in the new battery on Thursday, I took the bike around the block. Both lights came on together and went off together about 10 seconds later. Then, yesterday, I did the testing, then took her out again. When I fired up the bike, the check engine light came on normally, then went out. But then it came on again for about 10 seconds. Then it went out and stayed out. The low battery light didn't come on at all. This happened on several starts. I thought I might be home free. But no, on my last ride, the check engine and battery lights came on, but went off again after a few seconds. so I'm really puzzled.


Here's are the results of my testing. Does this all sound normal?

Step 1. First things first, load test the battery. Most places like Auto Zone will do it for free. Even if it measures over 12.5 vdc it can still be bad under a load. Battery is typically rated at 19 amp hours and 270 Cold Cranking Amps (CCA).

It's a new battery, so I'm going to assume it's OK


Start the engine and measure DC Volts across the battery terminals, the regulator should be putting out 14.3 - 14.7 vdc at 3600 rpm and 75 degrees F.

I don't have a tach, but it does flicker between 14-15 (the DMM doesn't seem to do decimals) when I rev the throttle

Step 2. To check the regulator unplug it from the stator. Take a test light and clip it to the negative terminal of the battery and then touch first one pin and then the other on the plug that goes to the regulator. If you get even the slightest amount of light from the test light the regulator is toast.

No light whatsoever

To do this with a meter which is more accurate: black lead to battery ground, red lead to each pin on the plug, start with the voltage scale higher than 12vdc and move voltage scale down in steps for each pin. Any voltage is a bad regulator.
You may get battery voltage on all three pins on the newer 3 phase regulators.
The no voltage is for older type regulators with diode indicating the diode is bad and the regulator needs replacing.

My DMM's probes won't reach that far, and not sure from the above if I have a phase 3 regulator, although it does have three pins

Step 3. On the other part of the disconnected regulator plug. Set the multimeter for Ohms x1 scale and measure for resistance across the pins of the stator. You should read something around 0.1 to 0.2 ohms for the TC88 32 amp system.

I have a 38 amp system with three pins/sockets. I measured across the sockets with the DMM probes and after jumping around briefly, the reading settled at .6 ohms (the max in the manual for my system is .5, so that seems to be in the ball park, again given the cheapo dmm).

Step 4. Then check for continuity between each pin on the plug and frame/engine ground. The meter needle should not move (infinite resistance)(digitals will show infinite resistance) if the meter needle does move (indicating continuity)(digitals will show some resistance), recheck very carefully. If the meter still shows continuity to ground the stator is shorted (bad).

touched the red probe to each socket (the pins go to the regulator) and the black probe to the frame. My meter is digital and there was no change in the reading, so I assume that means no continuity.

Step 5. Set the meter to read A/C volts higher than 30 volts (the scale setting for voltage should always be higher than the highest voltage you expect or you may fry the meter). Start the bike, and measure from one pin to the other on the plug (DO NOT cross the multimeter probes! - touch them to each other). You should read roughly 16-20 vac per 1,000 rpm.

Couldn't do this test by myself

Step 6. If the battery was good under load test, if the stator is NOT shorted to ground, and the stator is putting out A/C voltage, then the regulator is bad (most likely even if if passed step 2).


Generally the following is true:
Check your owners/service manual for the system amp output for your bike.
22 amp system produces about 19-26 vac per 1,000 rpm, stator resistance is about 0.2 to 0.4 ohms.
32 amp system produces about 16-20 vac per 1,000 rpm, stator resistance is about 0.1 to 0.2 ohms.
45 amp system produces about 19-26 vac per 1,000 rpm, stator resistance is about 0.1 to 0.2 ohms.

Also see here...
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Old Jun 19th, 2010, 11:49 AM     #5
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Re: Stator Gone Bad

Even quicker than eletrical test, open the primary chain inspection hole and take a whiff...it has a strong acrid odor and not plain gear oil smell you have a bad stator.
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Old Jun 19th, 2010, 03:27 PM     #6
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Re: Stator Gone Bad

Quote: Originally Posted by NEWHD74FAN View Post
Even quicker than eletrical test, open the primary chain inspection hole and take a whiff...it has a strong acrid odor and not plain gear oil smell you have a bad stator.
Tried that. No unusual odor whatsoever. The way these lights seem to go on and off, it's almost like it's shorting out somewhere
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Old Jun 21st, 2010, 08:22 PM     #7
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Re: Stator Gone Bad

Quote: Originally Posted by Casey0211 View Post
I bought a new battery, since the existing one was already 2-3 years old, and also a cheap multi-meter from Harbor Freight (probably not the good meter you were referring to, but serviceable, I hope), and did at least some of the testing that Glide posted. The results are below and seemed pretty good. Until I got on the bike and again and took a couple short rides. After putting in the new battery on Thursday, I took the bike around the block. Both lights came on together and went off together about 10 seconds later. Then, yesterday, I did the testing, then took her out again. When I fired up the bike, the check engine light came on normally, then went out. But then it came on again for about 10 seconds. Then it went out and stayed out. The low battery light didn't come on at all. This happened on several starts. I thought I might be home free. But no, on my last ride, the check engine and battery lights came on, but went off again after a few seconds. so I'm really puzzled.


Here's are the results of my testing. Does this all sound normal?

Step 1. First things first, load test the battery. Most places like Auto Zone will do it for free. Even if it measures over 12.5 vdc it can still be bad under a load. Battery is typically rated at 19 amp hours and 270 Cold Cranking Amps (CCA).

It's a new battery, so I'm going to assume it's OK


Start the engine and measure DC Volts across the battery terminals, the regulator should be putting out 14.3 - 14.7 vdc at 3600 rpm and 75 degrees F.

I don't have a tach, but it does flicker between 14-15 (the DMM doesn't seem to do decimals) when I rev the throttle

Step 2. To check the regulator unplug it from the stator. Take a test light and clip it to the negative terminal of the battery and then touch first one pin and then the other on the plug that goes to the regulator. If you get even the slightest amount of light from the test light the regulator is toast.

No light whatsoever

To do this with a meter which is more accurate: black lead to battery ground, red lead to each pin on the plug, start with the voltage scale higher than 12vdc and move voltage scale down in steps for each pin. Any voltage is a bad regulator.
You may get battery voltage on all three pins on the newer 3 phase regulators.
The no voltage is for older type regulators with diode indicating the diode is bad and the regulator needs replacing.

My DMM's probes won't reach that far, and not sure from the above if I have a phase 3 regulator, although it does have three pins

Step 3. On the other part of the disconnected regulator plug. Set the multimeter for Ohms x1 scale and measure for resistance across the pins of the stator. You should read something around 0.1 to 0.2 ohms for the TC88 32 amp system.

I have a 38 amp system with three pins/sockets. I measured across the sockets with the DMM probes and after jumping around briefly, the reading settled at .6 ohms (the max in the manual for my system is .5, so that seems to be in the ball park, again given the cheapo dmm).

Step 4. Then check for continuity between each pin on the plug and frame/engine ground. The meter needle should not move (infinite resistance)(digitals will show infinite resistance) if the meter needle does move (indicating continuity)(digitals will show some resistance), recheck very carefully. If the meter still shows continuity to ground the stator is shorted (bad).

touched the red probe to each socket (the pins go to the regulator) and the black probe to the frame. My meter is digital and there was no change in the reading, so I assume that means no continuity.

Step 5. Set the meter to read A/C volts higher than 30 volts (the scale setting for voltage should always be higher than the highest voltage you expect or you may fry the meter). Start the bike, and measure from one pin to the other on the plug (DO NOT cross the multimeter probes! - touch them to each other). You should read roughly 16-20 vac per 1,000 rpm.

Couldn't do this test by myself

Step 6. If the battery was good under load test, if the stator is NOT shorted to ground, and the stator is putting out A/C voltage, then the regulator is bad (most likely even if if passed step 2).


Generally the following is true:
Check your owners/service manual for the system amp output for your bike.
22 amp system produces about 19-26 vac per 1,000 rpm, stator resistance is about 0.2 to 0.4 ohms.
32 amp system produces about 16-20 vac per 1,000 rpm, stator resistance is about 0.1 to 0.2 ohms.
45 amp system produces about 19-26 vac per 1,000 rpm, stator resistance is about 0.1 to 0.2 ohms.

Also see here...
I have a 2008 FXDF that had the check engine and battery light come on and then went off after a restart, but by the time I got home the battery would not start the bike

I checked the 3 pin stator output connector and get 20 to 25-30 volts AC depending on RPM across any two of the three pins - I also have .2-.3 ohms between any two of the three pins and .2 to .3 ohms from any of the three pins to ground and no bad smell from the engine oil...... so I think my stator is good

I did the regulator check above (VOM from the battery negative to the regulator with the regulator and stator disconnected) one pin on the regulator started with 4 volts and slowly dropped to .3 volts - the other pin started at 1.3 volts and dropped to zero - does this show that the regulator is bad.... I hope!
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Old Jun 22nd, 2010, 01:09 AM     #8
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Re: Stator Gone Bad

Quote: Originally Posted by mharrigan View Post
I have a 2008 FXDF that had the check engine and battery light come on and then went off after a restart, but by the time I got home the battery would not start the bike

I checked the 3 pin stator output connector and get 20 to 25-30 volts AC depending on RPM across any two of the three pins - I also have .2-.3 ohms between any two of the three pins and .2 to .3 ohms from any of the three pins to ground and no bad smell from the engine oil...... so I think my stator is good

I did the regulator check above (VOM from the battery negative to the regulator with the regulator and stator disconnected) one pin on the regulator started with 4 volts and slowly dropped to .3 volts - the other pin started at 1.3 volts and dropped to zero - does this show that the regulator is bad.... I hope!
Your regulator is acting suspicious, although the instructions are a little unclear to me. It sounds like you have a three-pin system, where some voltage is expected. Let me know what it turns out to be.

As for me, I wound up going to the dealer, where the service advisor said it was probably a bad stator. I had been thinking that was probably the case too and since I'd already ordered and received a new stator through a catalog, I decided to replace it myself. Well, it definintely wasn't the stator. The engine and battery lights still come on, and the stator I pulled from the bike couldn't have been more pristine if I'd just pulled it out of a box. So I'm taking it to the dealer again and having them check the regulator. Mine showed no voltage using a simple light, but the self-help guide seems to indicate that three pin system show some voltage, so maybe some light was in order. I'm not sure if the fact that mine doesn't appear to show any at all means it's screwed up.

Personally, I think there's a short somewhere. Andthat it could be dealer induced. About a month ago I had them replace a starter clutch. It's shortly after that that this problem began. Does anyone know if a starter clutch repair might be susceptible to causing a short or a bad connection somewhere?
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Old Jun 22nd, 2010, 01:26 AM     #9
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Re: Stator Gone Bad

Quote: Originally Posted by Casey0211 View Post
Your regulator is acting suspicious, although the instructions are a little unclear to me. It sounds like you have a three-pin system, where some voltage is expected. Let me know what it turns out to be.

As for me, I wound up going to the dealer, where the service advisor said it was probably a bad stator. I had been thinking that was probably the case too and since I'd already ordered and received a new stator through a catalog, I decided to replace it myself. Well, it definintely wasn't the stator. The engine and battery lights still come on, and the stator I pulled from the bike couldn't have been more pristine if I'd just pulled it out of a box. So I'm taking it to the dealer again and having them check the regulator. Mine showed no voltage using a simple light, but the self-help guide seems to indicate that three pin system show some voltage, so maybe some light was in order. I'm not sure if the fact that mine doesn't appear to show any at all means it's screwed up.

Personally, I think there's a short somewhere. Andthat it could be dealer induced. About a month ago I had them replace a starter clutch. It's shortly after that that this problem began. Does anyone know if a starter clutch repair might be susceptible to causing a short or a bad connection somewhere?
Well here's a strange twist. The battery ran down earlier today while I was doing some testing. Bike wouldn't start. I just went out to the garage and it started right up.
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Old Jun 22nd, 2010, 06:09 AM     #10
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Re: Bad stator

Since you recently had work done and from your symptoms, sounds like it could be a bad connection somewhere. I would start with your main battery cables at both ends on all of them. Remove, clean, and replace. Triple check the ground cable mounted near the starter. Good luck!
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