Rear sprocket bolts.

porkchop · Apr 18th, 2009, 10:20 AM

Do the rear sprocket bolts realy need to be replaced once they have been removed? If there grade 8 and threaded into a aluminum hub i wouldnt think they could stretch. I had been told to replace them by a dealer and an indy said it wasnt needed. I find it hard to beleive that they would need to be replaced. I have allready reused them a couple of times now and torque them to spec with out any issues.

smitty901 · Apr 18th, 2009, 10:26 AM

Well age old question can I get away with with it? yep till the time you don't.
And as of advise from an Indy well well know they have the the inside track on everything thats why they are indys.
I see this all the time on heavy equipment CAT say replace someone decides to save a trip to Cat down the raod new part is trashe becasue a comnnection failed or fastener failed your call

porkchop · Apr 18th, 2009, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smitty901

Well age old question can I get away with with it? yep till the time you don't.
And as of advise from an Indy well well know they have the the inside track on everything thats why they are indys.
I see this all the time on heavy equipment CAT say replace someone decides to save a trip to Cat down the raod new part is trashe becasue a comnnection failed or fastener failed your call

Well im not against replacing them but i just figured that the aluminum threads in the hub would stip out before the grade 8 bolt would stretch or even weaken. I do use lock tight and the torque spec is only 55 to 60 ft lbs. maybe i will just go ahead and replace them any way.

bwalsh22 · Apr 18th, 2009, 04:17 PM

I just went through that with mine, for the price, easier to just replace them.

jel123 · Apr 18th, 2009, 04:32 PM

I can,t belive a grade 8 bolt being torqued to 65 pounds would need to be replaced,jel

fin_676 · Apr 18th, 2009, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smitty901

Well age old question can I get away with with it? yep till the time you don't.
And as of advise from an Indy well well know they have the the inside track on everything thats why they are indys.
I see this all the time on heavy equipment CAT say replace someone decides to save a trip to Cat down the raod new part is trashe becasue a comnnection failed or fastener failed your call

I'm sure that the hd dealer will be right with everything well they will sell the best boots money can buy cos the hd badge is on them

The indy may be a proper engineer rather than an hd trained money collector
steel bolts going into aluminium shouldn't strain the bolts if that were the case then every time you removed a bolt you'd have to replace it
However the bolt may be placed under strain by the action of the brake
As i have a tendency to replace all fasteners with stainless steel id fit stainless as a matter of course (harsh environment in north Scotland)

Brian

jmpancoast · Apr 18th, 2009, 06:37 PM

Absolutely replace them. Lots of occurances of them shearing off. I can provide you with references, if you would like.

STEVE07 · Apr 18th, 2009, 07:17 PM

I deal with fasteners all the time,and when I used to rig steel I had to know the limits of a fastener.My opinion is that you don't have to replace the grade 8 bolts you have never stressed them ! check this out:

Mark’s Standard Handbook for Mechanical Engineers lists Grade 5 fasteners as 120 ksi fasteners. This means the tensile strength is 120,000 lbs per square inch. It also lists Grade 8’s as 150 ksi fasteners meaning the tensile strength is 150,000 lbs per square inch. Also, the ultimate shear strength of a fastener is typically about 60% of its ultimate tension strength. So given a certain diameter (cross-sectional area) and strength rating, someone can figure out how much load that fastener can carry in both tension and shear.

Using a .250-inch diameter grade 8 fastener gives you the following shear capability:

A = Cross-sectional area of the fastener size (since bolt bodies/shanks have circular cross-sections, use area of a circle) = Pi x r2 where R (radius) = .250/2 = .125, therefore A = Pi x (.125)2 = .0491 square inches (in2)
Capability in shear = 91,000 lbs / in2 x .0491 in2 = 4468 lbs

Using the same .250-inch diameter grade 5 fastener results in the following:
Capability in shear = 75,000 lbs / in2 x .0491 in2 = 3683 lbs

Hope this helps

Brutal FXDX · Apr 18th, 2009, 09:03 PM

There actually is a service bulletin the factory came out with last year and includes all beltdrive models. Yes replace the bolts, red loctite, and new torque spec. I believe it is 75-80 ft. lbs.

dangerdan · Apr 19th, 2009, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STEVE07

I deal with fasteners all the time,and when I used to rig steel I had to know the limits of a fastener.My opinion is that you don't have to replace the grade 8 bolts you have never stressed them ! check this out:

Mark’s Standard Handbook for Mechanical Engineers lists Grade 5 fasteners as 120 ksi fasteners. This means the tensile strength is 120,000 lbs per square inch. It also lists Grade 8’s as 150 ksi fasteners meaning the tensile strength is 150,000 lbs per square inch. Also, the ultimate shear strength of a fastener is typically about 60% of its ultimate tension strength. So given a certain diameter (cross-sectional area) and strength rating, someone can figure out how much load that fastener can carry in both tension and shear.

Using a .250-inch diameter grade 8 fastener gives you the following shear capability:

A = Cross-sectional area of the fastener size (since bolt bodies/shanks have circular cross-sections, use area of a circle) = Pi x r2 where R (radius) = .250/2 = .125, therefore A = Pi x (.125)2 = .0491 square inches (in2)
Capability in shear = 91,000 lbs / in2 x .0491 in2 = 4468 lbs

Using the same .250-inch diameter grade 5 fastener results in the following:
Capability in shear = 75,000 lbs / in2 x .0491 in2 = 3683 lbs

Hope this helps

Steve , I am not an engineer , but those numbers only tell us how many lbs are required to shear a bolt.

What is the actual number of "lbs" exerted on one of those bolts during a hard acceleration or de-acceleration.

My bike weight is about 800 lb
I weight 260 lb
My riding partner weight is about 140 lb

Thats a total 1200 lb dead weight.
Now factor in a hard acceleration in first gear.

Again I am not an engineer, so I cant do the math. It would be interesting to know what kinds of forces are exerted on those bolts. Until someone can, I think it worthwhile to replace those bolts.

Thanks for the math lession. That formula is now recorded in my books.

Apr 18th, 2009, 10:20 AM	#1
porkchop Play The Throttle Ride: 2006 dyna Join Date: Nov 12th, 2008 Location: West Tawakoni,TX. Posts: 203 My Mood:	Rear sprocket bolts. Do the rear sprocket bolts realy need to be replaced once they have been removed? If there grade 8 and threaded into a aluminum hub i wouldnt think they could stretch. I had been told to replace them by a dealer and an indy said it wasnt needed. I find it hard to beleive that they would need to be replaced. I have allready reused them a couple of times now and torque them to spec with out any issues. __________________ "RIDE IT HARD-PUT IT UP WET "

Apr 18th, 2009, 10:26 AM	#2
smitty901 Retired Moderators Ride: 2007 Road glide Join Date: Jan 1st, 2008 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 5,952 My Mood:	Re: Rear sprocket bolts. Well age old question can I get away with with it? yep till the time you don't. And as of advise from an Indy well well know they have the the inside track on everything thats why they are indys. I see this all the time on heavy equipment CAT say replace someone decides to save a trip to Cat down the raod new part is trashe becasue a comnnection failed or fastener failed your call __________________ The Infantry leads the way

Apr 18th, 2009, 04:17 PM	#4
bwalsh22 Community Star Ride: 2006 FXDBI Street Bob Join Date: May 15th, 2008 Location: Easton, PA Posts: 460 My Mood:	Re: Rear sprocket bolts. I just went through that with mine, for the price, easier to just replace them.

Apr 18th, 2009, 04:32 PM	#5
jel123 Play The Throttle Ride: 1999 custom Join Date: Feb 16th, 2009 Posts: 159 My Mood:	Re: Rear sprocket bolts. I can,t belive a grade 8 bolt being torqued to 65 pounds would need to be replaced,jel

Apr 18th, 2009, 06:37 PM	#7
jmpancoast Contributor$ Ride: 06 FXDI Join Date: Nov 22nd, 2008 Location: Chesterfield, VA Posts: 215 My Mood:	Re: Rear sprocket bolts. Absolutely replace them. Lots of occurances of them shearing off. I can provide you with references, if you would like.

Apr 18th, 2009, 07:17 PM	#8
STEVE07 Moderators Ride: 2007FLHTC Join Date: Oct 4th, 2008 Location: Kitchener Ontario Canada Posts: 3,577 My Mood:	Re: Rear sprocket bolts. I deal with fasteners all the time,and when I used to rig steel I had to know the limits of a fastener.My opinion is that you don't have to replace the grade 8 bolts you have never stressed them ! check this out: Mark’s Standard Handbook for Mechanical Engineers lists Grade 5 fasteners as 120 ksi fasteners. This means the tensile strength is 120,000 lbs per square inch. It also lists Grade 8’s as 150 ksi fasteners meaning the tensile strength is 150,000 lbs per square inch. Also, the ultimate shear strength of a fastener is typically about 60% of its ultimate tension strength. So given a certain diameter (cross-sectional area) and strength rating, someone can figure out how much load that fastener can carry in both tension and shear. Using a .250-inch diameter grade 8 fastener gives you the following shear capability: A = Cross-sectional area of the fastener size (since bolt bodies/shanks have circular cross-sections, use area of a circle) = Pi x r2 where R (radius) = .250/2 = .125, therefore A = Pi x (.125)2 = .0491 square inches (in2) Capability in shear = 91,000 lbs / in2 x .0491 in2 = 4468 lbs Using the same .250-inch diameter grade 5 fastener results in the following: Capability in shear = 75,000 lbs / in2 x .0491 in2 = 3683 lbs Hope this helps __________________ Please stop by the "self help section" for maintenance tips, diagnostic codes and much more. click me!>>Self Help Information and Tips<< click me!

Apr 18th, 2009, 09:03 PM	#9
Brutal FXDX Start The Engine Ride: 2002 FXDX Join Date: Apr 18th, 2009 Location: Myrtle Beach, SC The Brutal Beach Posts: 20	Re: Rear sprocket bolts. There actually is a service bulletin the factory came out with last year and includes all beltdrive models. Yes replace the bolts, red loctite, and new torque spec. I believe it is 75-80 ft. lbs.

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Rear sprocket bolts.

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