Harley Davidson Forums

Loading


Hello

Guest

Welcome to the harley davidson forum. Join our discussion today for FREE!

CREATE ACCOUNT

Membership Benefits

Get your questions answered by harley davidson community gurus and industry experts. Exchange your experience with another members. Access full features forum. Get a members discounts for your harley parts & accessories.

Gas mixing with oil...

Dyna Models

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Dec 13th, 2008, 07:14 PM     #1
Start The Engine
Ride: 2000 Dyna Wide Glide
 
lilrich2u's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 23rd, 2008
Location: Northern California
Posts: 10
My Mood: My Mood
lilrich2u is an unknown quantity at this point
Gas mixing with oil...

I havent rode my 2000 Dyna Wide Glide in about a month, then last week something a little odd happened.

I was coming back from a hour long drive, turned on my street to go home and the engine started acting like I was running out of fuel. I pull over to turn the petcock and for a microsecond, even with the clutch pulled in the bike acted like it wanted to keep running in gear. At the time with it being so cold I thought maybe I just pulled on the front brake lever instead of the clutch or something... it was freakin cold and I was a little braindead.

I switch the petcock over and the hesitation stops.. I drive home and everything seemed fine.

About two days later I see my bike leaking a TON of oil on the ground. Pull the dipstick out and there is a significant amount of gas that has mixed with oil.

So at this point my gameplan is to change out the oil, pull the carbs and check the float bowl and overall clean the carbs with cleaner. Im also gonna double check all the bolts and make sure everything is tight. Im just wondering if I have permanently lost a gasket someplace to cause the bad oil leaks or if the viscosity of the oil mixing with gas caused it and once I put new oil in there everything will go back to normal.

If anyone has any ideas or tips it would be highly appreciated. Im not a total newbie to bikes, but Im not a mechanic either.

Thanks and take care.
Rich
lilrich2u is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 13th, 2008, 10:40 PM     #2
Moderators
Ride: '11 FLSTC (Heritage Softail Classic)
 
TQuentin1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 4th, 2008
Location: Summerwood in Humble, TX
Posts: 4,292
TQuentin1 is on a distinguished road
Re: Gas mixing with oil...

Quote: Originally Posted by lilrich2u View Post
About two days later I see my bike leaking a TON of oil on the ground. Pull the dipstick out and there is a significant amount of gas that has mixed with oil.
Rich,

Was the level in the oil tank high when cold, i.e., close to or higher than the high level on the stick?

I have had my float malfunction and had gas leak out of the bowl and gas tank (yes, I know I am supposed to close the tank valve every time I stop!!) which definitely "washes" the bike and puts an oily mess under the bike. But the engine was not leaking oil, the gas was washing the oil off the engine and dripping an oily mess under the bike. With gas everywhere, if you pulled the dip stick it might seem like it smelled of gas too.

What I can not figure is how the gas could communicate with the oil unless there are some other serious problems that would make the bike run terribly.

We will have to see if other folks with carbed bikes chime in with this problem in the past and can enlighten us.

TQ
__________________

Please stop by the "The Self-Help pages."
>>Self-Help Information and Tips - Harley Davidson Community Self-Help Threads Information<< click me!
TQuentin1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 14th, 2008, 12:16 AM     #3
Start The Engine
Ride: 2000 Dyna Wide Glide
 
lilrich2u's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 23rd, 2008
Location: Northern California
Posts: 10
My Mood: My Mood
lilrich2u is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Gas mixing with oil...

A lot of what you were saying totally rings true. Ive had a very slow leak since Ive owned the bike but could never pinpoint it.. from that the bike has always had oil underneath. So your theory that the oil on the ground was actually old oil that was washed off from the leaking gas totally makes sense.

The oil level when cold looked about average, but because the gas was mixing with the oil it wouldnt stick to the dipstick and hard to tell. There is definately gas in with the oil. The oil has the same consistancy as water and smells like gas on my fingers.

Im just hoping this entire thing isnt gonna be your typical "hd big job" where its a grand or more to fix. I love my bike but theres been a ton of little things that have gone wrong.

Any advice is greatly appreciated.
lilrich2u is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 14th, 2008, 01:01 AM     #4
Warming The Wheels
Ride: Night Train
 
Join Date: Dec 13th, 2008
Posts: 105
whiterider is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Gas mixing with oil...

I used to religously turn off the petrol on my '99 FXDX and the 1340s before that because of exactly the problem you are having. A friend who was a HD mechanic said it wasn't worth the risk not to. By the sound of it he was right. Good luck with the oil change.
whiterider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 14th, 2008, 01:33 PM     #5
Contributor
Ride: FLHR 09/103"
 
BUBBIE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 15th, 2008
Location: AZ, S.East corner/Western WA.
Posts: 4,622
My Mood: My Mood
BUBBIE has a spectacular aura aboutBUBBIE has a spectacular aura about
Re: Gas mixing with oil...

I have a 2000 dyna and have had NO problem with the gas to oil ....

It sounds like gas is LEAKING past the VACUUM OFF and PAST the carb.float needle valve.....(BOTH)

gas is on a vacuum basis when engine is running:engine draws vacuum to OPEN gas tank valve.....ONLY in off position is it OFF.
you must have a defective shut-off vacuum valve......(sticking open)

You also must have a TOO HIGH a float level or dirty needle NOT allowing gas to STOP when float-needle say to. No other way for gas to leak into engine unless BOTH vacuum valve and carb float shut-off are not working properly.

so I'd think BOTH are the problem...

You can always turn to OFF at the tank but ????? if you forget!!!

signed....BUBBIE
BUBBIE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 14th, 2008, 02:12 PM     #6
Retired Moderators
Ride: 2004 Sportster XL1200R
 
NEWHD74FAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 24th, 2008
Location: Camarillo, CA
Posts: 8,276
My Mood: My Mood
NEWHD74FAN is an unknown quantity at this point
Thumbs up Re: Gas mixing with oil...

Quote: Originally Posted by Hobbit View Post
sportsters can suffer with this issue as well - it always pays to turn of the tap.
I would remove/strip and clean the carb just for good measure - remember to take note of how manys turns are on the mixture screw.
check the vaccumm lines from the petcock.
change out the oil and filter
Hobbit, you are right on! Had to do the deed on my brand "Y" metric back in 1992...but also had to rebuild the starter too, as it was flooded with oil and gas as well!


Quote: Originally Posted by BUBBIE View Post
I have a 2000 dyna and have had NO problem with the gas to oil ....

It sounds like gas is LEAKING past the VACUUM OFF and PAST the carb.float needle valve.....(BOTH)

Gas valve is on a vacuum basis when engine is running: engine draws vacuum to OPEN gas tank valve.....ONLY in off position is it OFF. You must have a defective shut-off vacuum valve...(sticking open)

You also must have TOO HIGH a float level or dirty needle NOT allowing gas to STOP when float-needle says to. No other way for gas to leak into engine unless BOTH vacuum valve and carb float shut-off are not working properly.

So I'd think BOTH are the problem...

You can always turn fuel petcock to OFF at the tank but ??? if you forget!!!

signed....BUBBIE
Bubbie, you get the bells and thumbs up from me!
NEWHD74FAN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 14th, 2008, 07:11 PM     #7
Play The Throttle
Ride: 2006 dyna
 
porkchop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 12th, 2008
Location: Somewhere,TX.
Posts: 220
My Mood: My Mood
porkchop is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Gas mixing with oil...

Quote: Originally Posted by lilrich2u View Post
A lot of what you were saying totally rings true. Ive had a very slow leak since Ive owned the bike but could never pinpoint it.. from that the bike has always had oil underneath. So your theory that the oil on the ground was actually old oil that was washed off from the leaking gas totally makes sense.

The oil level when cold looked about average, but because the gas was mixing with the oil it wouldnt stick to the dipstick and hard to tell. There is definately gas in with the oil. The oil has the same consistancy as water and smells like gas on my fingers.

Im just hoping this entire thing isnt gonna be your typical "hd big job" where its a grand or more to fix. I love my bike but theres been a ton of little things that have gone wrong.

Any advice is greatly appreciated.
Just remember that when your bike is leaning on the kick stand that when your float and needle stick that the gas will run first down thru the intake and into the cylinders and go around the piston rings. I have seen this happen many times and even a full tank of gas, it litteraly started to run out of the dipstick itself. This can even happen on softails as well but the gas will only fill the engine sump untill you try to start it up, this could be a dissaster.
__________________
The way to a man's hart is with new shiny bike part's!
porkchop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 14th, 2008, 07:19 PM     #8
Start The Engine
Ride: 2000 Dyna Wide Glide
 
lilrich2u's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 23rd, 2008
Location: Northern California
Posts: 10
My Mood: My Mood
lilrich2u is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Gas mixing with oil...

"but the gas will only fill the engine sump untill you try to start it up, this could be a dissaster."

Thank you very much for the advice btw.

Just wanted to clarify something from what you said... should I be doing something more than changing the oil and filter before I try and start it up?

Dont know if you meant it would be a disaster if I tried to start it as is, or if there is more I should do than the oil/filter change.

Thanks again,
Rich
lilrich2u is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 14th, 2008, 07:29 PM     #9
Community Guru Wannabe
Ride: 2007 softail fxst
 
wildspirit97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 12th, 2007
Location: Washington
Posts: 1,088
My Mood: My Mood
wildspirit97 is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Gas mixing with oil...

I think if it was me I would buy some cheaper brand oil and filter, change it and run it for a 10 minutes and then change it again with some good oil just to make sure to get it all out.
wildspirit97 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 15th, 2008, 05:41 AM     #10
Play The Throttle
Ride: 2006 dyna
 
porkchop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 12th, 2008
Location: Somewhere,TX.
Posts: 220
My Mood: My Mood
porkchop is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Gas mixing with oil...

Quote: Originally Posted by wildspirit97 View Post
I think if it was me I would buy some cheaper brand oil and filter, change it and run it for a 10 minutes and then change it again with some good oil just to make sure to get it all out.
Thats exactly right just buy some cheap no name oil to flush the system out. Your dyna has the oil down below the trans so when the gas leaks through it will mainly be in the oil pan, there would only be about a half a qt in the sump as for the softail it has an oil tank mounted up highso the engine would be full before the gas would show up in the oil tank until you tried to start it up. Dont forget to take care of that carb problem, it could be a small piece of trash thats got the needle valve hung open. Hope this helps.
__________________
The way to a man's hart is with new shiny bike part's!
porkchop is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mixing D401 & D402 nramike Wheels 4 Apr 9th, 2009 01:04 AM
mixing oil weights? Das Motorad Oil 1 Oct 5th, 2007 06:13 PM
Mixing Brake Fluids glider. Brakes, Tires and Wheels 0 Jun 23rd, 2007 03:33 PM